9440. A person unacquainted with the arcana of heaven may think that no one can see planets so far away and through what he has experienced with his senses report about them. But let it be recognized that intervals of space and distances between places, and consequent movements from one to another, which are visible in the natural world, are first occasioned by and have their origin in the changes of state undergone by the interiors, and that among angels and spirits appearances are in exact accord with those changes. In this way spirits and angels can be transported from one place to another, and from one planet to another, even to planets on the edge of the universe. The same thing can be done to a person's spirit while his body remains where it is. It has happened to me also, for I have been allowed in the Lord's Divine mercy to mix with spirits as a spirit, while at the same time mixing with people on earth as a person on earth. Regarding intervals of space and distances between places, and movements from one to another in heaven, that they are appearances which are products of changes of state undergone by the interiors, see 5605. The person who thinks on a sensory level does not see how anyone's spirit can be transported in that way, for he dwells within space and time and measures his movements from one place to another according to them.