4946. There are some who in the life of the body have become imbued with the idea that man ought not to be concerned about those things which are of the internal man, thus about spiritual things, but only about those which are of the external man, or that are natural, for the reason that interior things disturb the delights of their life, and produce discomfort. They acted upon the left knee, and a little above the knee in front, and also upon the sole of the right foot. I conversed with them in their place of abode; and they said that they had been of opinion in the life of the body that only external things are living, and that they did not understand what internal things are, consequently that they knew what is natural, but not what the spiritual is. But it was given me to tell them that by this means they had shut out from themselves innumerable things which might have flowed in from the spiritual world if they had acknowledged interior things, and thus had admitted them into the ideas of their thought. And it was also given to tell them that in every idea of thought there are innumerable things which to man, especially the natural man, appear merely as a single uncompounded thing; when yet there are indefinite things in it which flow in from the spiritual world, and in a spiritual man produce superior insight, by which he can see and also perceive whether anything is true or not. And because they were in doubt in regard to this, it was shown them by living experience. There was represented to them a single idea, which they saw as one simple idea, and thus as an obscure point (by a mode of representation very easy in the light of heaven); but when that idea was unfolded, and at the same time their interior sight opened, there was then manifested as it were a universe leading to the Lord; and it was said that so it is with every idea of good and truth, namely, that it is an image of the whole heaven, because it is from the Lord, who is the all of heaven, or that itself which is called heaven.