You may see spoken above [909] about the deceitful hellish gang in that room almost at the back, where they do nothing but plot together how they can trick and cheat anyone who comes along. I spoke with this gang, and some expressed surprise that anyone was allowed to speak with them. But I replied that it was granted me to do this, to speak with even the worst devils, because they cannot hurt me at all. If it were otherwise and they were able to, then I would feel repulsion and fear; but there can be no fear of them in me because I am protected by the Lord. Therefore, it has never been forbidden me to talk with devils, if they wanted to talk with me, so that I might also learn what their life is like and what hell is like. Besides this I was also able to tell them that through my conversation with them, they can learn what they are like. For they, being carnal, do not know otherwise than that they are in the life of the body; so that in this way, they can be taught about themselves. And further, because they are in hell they are rather to be pitied than to have any harm done to them; and if I were to speak harsh words such as some souls have brought along with them from bodily life, then punishments would be added upon punishments for them, and this would be contrary to compassion and true caring. For it is a Christian quality to wish well even to them. And besides, some were people known to me in life, and I had not thought that they would become infernal [spirits].